Bottom Drain / Returns

[emmaandaj]

Hi All,

Can i ask for some advice on where i should place my bottom drain and my returns to get the best flow accross the pond. Obviously this is very important and i havent really got a clue! The plan is for a Nexus 300 on the bottom drain and eazy pod on the skimmer line.

Ive attached a pic of roughly where i was thinking the bottom drain should be, ive labelled where id probably put the returns as well and have no idea about where the skimmer would be best sited. The max flow rates the filters will handle is 2,800 gallons an hour on the nexus and 1,200 gallons an hour on the eazy pod. The filters will be sited next to the pond in the top left hand corner.

Any thoughts and ideas will be very very gratefully recieved!

Cheers Andy

[Gazza]

Hi Andy,

Most try to site the bottom drain in the center the slightly bench the bottom of the pond toward the drain.You could then place the returns so the water flows round the pond and even have them at different heights and angles to help mix the water.

But as you are having a aerated bottom drain this also help with the water flow

[emmaandaj]

Hi Gazza,

If i was to move the bottom drain to the centre of the pond would i require a rerturn coming from the bottom end of the pond back towards the other returns?

Will definately be using a aireated bottom drain, hopefully will be digging the trench for the bottom drain and electrics the weekend after next (hopefully when the pile of soil is gone!)

Any ideas on where best to site the skimmer?


Cheers Andy

[Gazza]

Hi Andy,

What a great shape pond you will have i have one just like it and here are some pictures which may help.I have a bottom drain in the center and the two 2" return pipes which are at opposite side and one is about 3ft down this is from the main filtration.The other is about 12"-18" down and is from the skimmer line.


Bottom Drain:

[img]http://www.koipix.com/gallery/albums/userpi ... 2_1289.jpg[/img]

Return from main filtration:

[img]http://www.koipix.com/gallery/albums/userpi ... 3_1307.jpg[/img]

[img]http://www.koipix.com/gallery/albums/userpi ... 3_1311.jpg[/img]

Skimmer and return from skimmer:

[img]http://www.koipix.com/gallery/albums/userpi ... 3_1309.jpg[/img]


If you need help with digging any more channels or trenches give me a call and i will send Holly over as she loves it

[img]http://www.koipix.com/gallery/albums/userpi ... 3_1325.jpg[/img]

[emmaandaj]

Hi Gazza,

I thought your pond was half a semi circle shape- didnt realise id actually copied you! Saying that me and Em had both said we liked the shape of your pond!

Will move bottom drain up, which will move it closer to filter which is good! From the pics am i right in thinking the returns are like this? My only concern would be the return at the bottom right would be along way from the fillter with lots of bends? However would be perfect for the main filter! Does this set up cause a swirling effect?

Cheers Andy

Ps could Holly train our three dogs to dig nice straight trenches like that!!!

[Gazza]

Hi Andy,

The main return from my pond runs to the shed where all the equipment is so its not a short run and thats why i made sure everything was done in 2" pressure pipe.

When the bottom drain is off you can see that the water is moving but its not like a whirlwind or anything like that

[emmaandaj]

Hi Gazza,

From memory your filters are a fair way from the pond- does this effect the flow of the pumps by much? Although the two inch pressure pipe must help. Do you think that i would be ok to put the skimmer on the other side of the pond? Am i rightin thinking you run both aquamax and sequence pumps? Not sure what i should go for? Already have a aquamax 10000 which i believe pumps 2000gph which is a bit small for the nexus and a bit large for the pod, although it could be used on my qt pond???

Cheers Andy

[Gazza]

Hi Andy,

I would think it would be OK to place you skimmer on the other side if needed.

I run Sequence 750 on the main pond and i used sweeping bends as much as i could to help with the flow.

[Jules]

I would put the returns you get a good flow. On the latest picture the right hand arrow place it on the bottm right of the picture pointing up towards the curve, this will give a natural push to the far end. The second arrow place it at the top left of the piture just before the corner and that will do the big push from the far end back to the horizontal. Put your skimmer in the same area your filters are going, A. It makes piepwkor easier, B You will already have electric there for your pump. The return for the skimmer I would place under the return on the bottom right. Does this make sense?

Jules

[emmaandaj]

Hi Jules,

Do you mean something like this? Think i understood!

Cheers Andy

[B.Scott]

I vote for this last model. This was my first thought when I saw the first drawing. I'd put the drain in the middle as well!

B.Scott

[Gazza]

I put mine in those position for similar reasons so the water pushes the same way....hopfully and so far it seems to be working

[emmaandaj]

Hi Guys,

Looks like a plan then! My filters located opposite to where Gazzas are located so hopefully should work in a similar manner! I hope my pond water is as crystal clear as Gazzas (i wish!)

Gazza can i ask you opinion on pumps-sequence or aquamax as i know you run both? I cant seem to find whichis cheaper to run although im sure the sequence ones are a bit cheaper (i think?)

Cheers Andy

[Telthepondman]

Hi Andy, for what it's worth this is what i would suggest, sure the bottom drain should be as near to the centre as it can be. Think of your pond as a giant vortex with your returns sending the water in a circular motion sending the muck to the centre. This shape of pond although pleasing to the eye is difficult to get moving correctly without [deadspots] which should be avoided at all cost.
I would go for 3 returns. One up the top l.h corner heading down. One at the left hand bottom corner heading right., and one at the bottom r.h corner heading up. This should get the water going round in a nice anti clokwise direction, [you can see that i do not subscribe to the idea of a vortex must be clockwise, but thats a whole new debate]. The skimmer cannot go next to a return and i would put it half way round the curve where there will be a nice gentle flow next to the skimmer which is ideal.
If you put a skimmer next to a return where the water is turbulent the surface debris will never get close enough to the skimmer to be drawn in.

Tel.

[Gazza]

Hi Tel,

First off i respect you views as i know you've built the odd pond or two

I do agree if a pond return is too close to the skimmer and too powerful you could end up with it not working correctly but thankfully in my case it works

I have a return which is the skimmer return beneath my skimmer as you can see in the pictures above now the reason for this was to push the water toward the long shaped wall and this makes its way round to the other side.Then the lower return will push in the same direction so hopefully moving the water at a nice steady flow in the same direction.The bottom drain has its own air pump so this in turn gives all the additions movement which help the pond mix and in doing so leaving no dead spots.

Now the interesting thing is if any uneaten food (i should be so lucky) or leaves that go on the surface end up in the skimmer and it works spot on and i have a few large trees which used to all dump in my garden and i would be emptying the skimmer daily

Andy,

I think both Sequence and Aqamax are great pumps and i use both as i have an Aquamax on my QT.I had to change the one on the QT as it did get an electrical fault but it was exchanged FOC.

Now the Sequence pumps i think are bullet proof i have even filled them with K1 during a filter conversion I have even isolated the pipe work with a ball valve and then turned of the wrong pump whilst carrying out cleaning so the pump was pumping a dead head for minutes plus and its still going