the biological filter.

[sam51]

hi all been thinking about this since i put the new filter in. with some old media.
now as nitrifing bacteria,is suppose to live everywhere, ie the filters,pond walls & floor, and pipework.
if you just changed the filter and media,would you get a ammonia rise, with new filter media, as wont the nitrifing bacteria that is every
where else be able to cope.

[Geoff9]

Hi Sam
I don't think it will or we wouldn't need a filter,but when they talk about a mature pond I have heard between 2 to 4 years,I think this is what people are talking about as it takes years for the bacteria on the floor walls,pipe work to mature as a filter is designed to work faster about 6 weeks in good conditions,just trying to help,

There are koi keeprs with more knowledge on this board so hopefuly someone will add to the post as it seems very quiet on here since Duncan as packed up the board,we don't want to loose this source of excellent knowledge.

Geoff

[Manky Sanke]

Sam,

As I said on the other forum, I'm busy preparing for the Koi Kanshou Kai weekend in Newmarket this weekend so I don't have time to get too involved in detailed discussions but, to answer your question, if you don't mind a rag tag of extracts from articles I've written, this collection of odd bits should give you the basic idea of what is happening.

Biological filters are not the only place in the koi pond and filter system where biological filtration takes place. Nitrifying bugs (nitrosomonas and nitrobacter) are prolific in nature, on land, everywhere in the aquatic environment, even in the air.

In a koi pond, they colonise any wet surface including the floor, walls and even inside pipe-work. In fact, they prefer the inside of pipe-work to open surfaces because they are photophobic, which means that they don’t like light. Light doesn’t harm them, but they prefer dark places and will multiply better without light. These bugs can swim because they have little whip-like tails that they can rotate and propel themselves through water. They can also take part in the nitrogen cycle whilst swimming but are more efficient when they can form a biofilm on solid surfaces.

They clearly can’t think or plan where they are going but they will propel themselves around seeking to avoid the light until they chance upon a dark place and settle onto a solid surface where they form their colonies. Ensuring our bio-filters are dark is the first step in encouraging bacteria to settle there and grow into mature colonies.

So, although these bugs get everywhere, and are in sufficient quantities in nature to cope with the stocking density in a natural lake, they aren't very efficient until we give them the best conditions - a well designed biological filter that will cope with the stocking densities of a pond. If you take away the bio-filter you would have to reduce the stocking level of your pond to that of a natural lake in order that natually occuring bugs could cope.

'Scuse the bitty reply, I'll have more time on Monday - make that Tuesday, I might sleep through Monday.

[sam51]

yo syd,yes i was referring to a established pond,and i brought up the post,because i thought it was your post i first read,
do you have any idea on how many fish could live in a given amount of water in a established pond on a short term basis,in a mature set up.
by the way i'm in a normal world, at the moment,this should last till the new year,then it will be worrying about the work coming in,and keeping the sharks from the door.but the koi ain't for sale.lol.

[Koi Man Dave]

yo syd,yes i was referring to a established pond,and i brought up the post,because i thought it was your post i first read,
do you have any idea on how many fish could live in a given amount of water in a established pond on a short term basis,in a mature set up.
by the way i'm in a normal world, at the moment,this should last till the new year,then it will be worrying about the work coming in,and keeping the sharks from the door.but the koi ain't for sale.lol.

Hi Sam

Hope you dont mind me jumping in here

This would depend on a few critical conditions the first key issue is the filteration and circulationand then the size of the pond etc.
I hav fond a guide for you as for stocking levels http://www.koiandponds.com/fishstockingtable.htm

[Duncan]

Hi

i dont know if i have time to get into this because ive just got into a new online course but whilst i whole heatedly agree with syd your all missing a trick here , but it may take this a tad off topic

a significant percentage of pond i visit have filters that are poorly put together, inadiquatley sized, poorly configured , poorly maintained, and just plain dont work! or are working at a lower ratio of whats required fact! in fact of these a large percentage are anearobic ! yet given this fact the pond supports life so first question, where do you suppose nitrogen is being dealt with?

couple to this and add to this equation, what is it a large percentage of koi keepers do today with regards to water balance that they did not do say 8 years ago?

this revelation is/was something i was going to get into testing but got it cut off in its prime, but it excited me and whats makes try and think outside the box

in support of syd, i am trying to seed some new ceramic media for my new tank, where do you think i have put this media for seeding? no not in the filter, but in the tank with an air stone under it so there is water movement through the media it will seed just as fast there as if it were installed in the filter
dunc
dave your supposed to be studying !

[sam51]

so guys on a mature pond,at this time of year,with a temp of 8 degrees,and dropping,with no food going in,would this be a problem if you
dumped all the media,and put a new lot in,bearing in mind,that this new media,would slowly start to colinise,and by spring wouldnt be far behind a mature filter.

[Geoff9]

Hi Dunc
I would think you are putting Ammonia in to seed the new filter media,then you will have to use some biocarb as the KH will get used up then the PH will drop.

Regards Geoff

[Koi Man Dave]

Hi

dave your supposed to be studying !

Point taken Duncan.