Hi Chi,
Thanks for the update and glad to see you getting back on top of things.
RO system query - mechanical
Moderators: B.Scott, vippymini, Gazza, Manky Sanke
Right Gazza, the results of the rope heater on the RO water mains feed pipe.
A winner I'm pleased to say, throughput has increased by 41%!
I've used a 500w, 5mm x 3m rope heater, wound tightly around a length of 15mm copper pipe. The winding covers around 1' of the 2' of copper pipe I've inserted into the PVC mains feed line take off for the RO system. A couple of simple grey plastic compression fittings were used for the joint. Initially as much heat if not more was radiated into the filter house as into the pipework, lagging required! I have now wrapped a couple of layers of heavy duty baco foil around the wound rope heater, then covered the whole issue with a piece of preformed glass wool steam pipe insulator. This is high temp cladding with a reinforced outer foil covering, it gets slightly warm but that's it, better than the PVC pipe I tried first, that just melted in seconds!
I'm very pleased, £45 total cost plus a couple of hours work, even on my sysytem with naffed membranes output rose instantly from 71 gpd to 100.5 gpd. Not good I know but will soon have new membranes installed, what then?
If I'm understanding what I've read on manufacturers websites correctly, warmer water not only raises production but increases the life of cartridges and membranes. For the price I'm delighted, highly recommended cheap mod.
Chi
A winner I'm pleased to say, throughput has increased by 41%!
I've used a 500w, 5mm x 3m rope heater, wound tightly around a length of 15mm copper pipe. The winding covers around 1' of the 2' of copper pipe I've inserted into the PVC mains feed line take off for the RO system. A couple of simple grey plastic compression fittings were used for the joint. Initially as much heat if not more was radiated into the filter house as into the pipework, lagging required! I have now wrapped a couple of layers of heavy duty baco foil around the wound rope heater, then covered the whole issue with a piece of preformed glass wool steam pipe insulator. This is high temp cladding with a reinforced outer foil covering, it gets slightly warm but that's it, better than the PVC pipe I tried first, that just melted in seconds!
I'm very pleased, £45 total cost plus a couple of hours work, even on my sysytem with naffed membranes output rose instantly from 71 gpd to 100.5 gpd. Not good I know but will soon have new membranes installed, what then?
If I'm understanding what I've read on manufacturers websites correctly, warmer water not only raises production but increases the life of cartridges and membranes. For the price I'm delighted, highly recommended cheap mod.
Chi
Right Gazza, the results of the rope heater on the RO water mains feed pipe.
A winner I'm pleased to say, throughput has increased by 41%!
I've used a 500w, 5mm x 3m rope heater, wound tightly around a length of 15mm copper pipe. The winding covers around 1' of the 2' of copper pipe I've inserted into the PVC mains feed line take off for the RO system. A couple of simple grey plastic compression fittings were used for the joint. Initially as much heat if not more was radiated into the filter house as into the pipework, lagging required! I have now wrapped a couple of layers of heavy duty baco foil around the wound rope heater, then covered the whole issue with a piece of preformed glass wool steam pipe insulator. This is high temp cladding with a reinforced outer foil covering, it gets slightly warm but that's it, better than the PVC pipe I tried first, that just melted in seconds!
I'm very pleased, £45 total cost plus a couple of hours work, even on my sysytem with naffed membranes output rose instantly from 71 gpd to 100.5 gpd. Not good I know but will soon have new membranes installed, what then?
If I'm understanding what I've read on manufacturers websites correctly, warmer water not only raises production but increases the life of cartridges and membranes. For the price I'm delighted, highly recommended cheap mod.
Oh, and it has also reduced the waste a little, improving product ratio!
Chi
A winner I'm pleased to say, throughput has increased by 41%!
I've used a 500w, 5mm x 3m rope heater, wound tightly around a length of 15mm copper pipe. The winding covers around 1' of the 2' of copper pipe I've inserted into the PVC mains feed line take off for the RO system. A couple of simple grey plastic compression fittings were used for the joint. Initially as much heat if not more was radiated into the filter house as into the pipework, lagging required! I have now wrapped a couple of layers of heavy duty baco foil around the wound rope heater, then covered the whole issue with a piece of preformed glass wool steam pipe insulator. This is high temp cladding with a reinforced outer foil covering, it gets slightly warm but that's it, better than the PVC pipe I tried first, that just melted in seconds!
I'm very pleased, £45 total cost plus a couple of hours work, even on my sysytem with naffed membranes output rose instantly from 71 gpd to 100.5 gpd. Not good I know but will soon have new membranes installed, what then?
If I'm understanding what I've read on manufacturers websites correctly, warmer water not only raises production but increases the life of cartridges and membranes. For the price I'm delighted, highly recommended cheap mod.
Oh, and it has also reduced the waste a little, improving product ratio!
Chi
Hi Dave, this one's easy as we both use the same RO kit.
The unit is 300 US gallons (240 UK gals.) per day, current system cost for the pumped version is around £330 inc. vat. Systems without the pump aren't worth the space they take up.
They will not actually produce these figures due to the fact all RO membranes are rated at a water temp of 25c, which of course you won't be providing! This means that 150 to 200 gpd is the realistic expectation, which is perfect as it provides enough to simultaneously top up my storage tank and trickle feed the pond.
On my 2000 gallon pond it took a few weeks to lower the TDS of 350 to it's current 120, PH followed to it's current 7.0 to 7.1, KH2 and GH 4.
Over the last few months I've evolved a system that works well for me, the RO system more than copes with all normal requirements.
I inserted a Y piece into the RO water output, one side goes to a nearby filter where it's tapped into the pond return. The other side of the Y splitter goes to a 125 gallon storage tank, which has a ball valve to shut off that feed when the tank is full. I then tapped the mains supply via a miniature ball valve, this allows me to trickle mains water to the pond alongside the RO water. This is set at 4 RO water to 1 mains, or 4 to 1, which for me produces water at KH2, perfect. I had to add an overflow to the pond but that was easy enough, I now flow around 100 gpd of this mix 24/7, which maintains pondwater at the required KH2.
The storage tank provides for filter flushing, allowing me to top up very quickly, as I have a small fountain pump in there and a pipe going straight to the pond. I have a ball valve in the pond supplying mains water, so whilst the tank is discharging RO water to the pond the mix is maintained. This way there is no fluctuation in the pond water TDS, PH or KH.
For me the above has worked perfectly for a few months, I'm delighted and the Koi are better than they've ever been.
Chi
The unit is 300 US gallons (240 UK gals.) per day, current system cost for the pumped version is around £330 inc. vat. Systems without the pump aren't worth the space they take up.
They will not actually produce these figures due to the fact all RO membranes are rated at a water temp of 25c, which of course you won't be providing! This means that 150 to 200 gpd is the realistic expectation, which is perfect as it provides enough to simultaneously top up my storage tank and trickle feed the pond.
On my 2000 gallon pond it took a few weeks to lower the TDS of 350 to it's current 120, PH followed to it's current 7.0 to 7.1, KH2 and GH 4.
Over the last few months I've evolved a system that works well for me, the RO system more than copes with all normal requirements.
I inserted a Y piece into the RO water output, one side goes to a nearby filter where it's tapped into the pond return. The other side of the Y splitter goes to a 125 gallon storage tank, which has a ball valve to shut off that feed when the tank is full. I then tapped the mains supply via a miniature ball valve, this allows me to trickle mains water to the pond alongside the RO water. This is set at 4 RO water to 1 mains, or 4 to 1, which for me produces water at KH2, perfect. I had to add an overflow to the pond but that was easy enough, I now flow around 100 gpd of this mix 24/7, which maintains pondwater at the required KH2.
The storage tank provides for filter flushing, allowing me to top up very quickly, as I have a small fountain pump in there and a pipe going straight to the pond. I have a ball valve in the pond supplying mains water, so whilst the tank is discharging RO water to the pond the mix is maintained. This way there is no fluctuation in the pond water TDS, PH or KH.
For me the above has worked perfectly for a few months, I'm delighted and the Koi are better than they've ever been.
Chi
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Gazza
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Hi Dave,
As above Chi has filled you in with the spec and such and i am equally pleased with my system.
I am still messing with mine and at present my TDS has gone up due to me leaving the mains water on whilst messing around
I am currently running PH of about 7.5 and a TDS of 150,not bad considering in September i had a PH of 8.5is and a TDS over 500!!!!!!!
Hope this helps i take it you are thinking about the RO route,if so what is your water like now???????
As above Chi has filled you in with the spec and such and i am equally pleased with my system.
I am still messing with mine and at present my TDS has gone up due to me leaving the mains water on whilst messing around
I am currently running PH of about 7.5 and a TDS of 150,not bad considering in September i had a PH of 8.5is and a TDS over 500!!!!!!!Hope this helps i take it you are thinking about the RO route,if so what is your water like now???????
hi Chita,Gazza
many thanks for the info.
yes I'm seriously thinking of going the r/o route next year,just trying to get all the info together.
my water is pretty good at the min,ammonia,nitrite both zero
nitrate 20mgl
kh 5
gh12
ph 7.4
tds in the pond 280(220 from the purifier)
the koi look great.
as you know i run showers straight from the b/drains as my main filtration,on the skimmer i have two Dave a 24" vortex's first static k, 2nd jap matt,i flush the static k to waste every day.the water fills on a trickle to waste system currently i change around 100galls per day.
i was mainly thinking of running a r/o system to reduce the gh(although i know this cannot be done without lowering the kh) and reduce the tds to around the 100>150 mark.
do you think i can obtain these figures without changing massive amounts of water?
what is the biggest change you have seen in your koi?
thanks again.
Dave.
many thanks for the info.
yes I'm seriously thinking of going the r/o route next year,just trying to get all the info together.
my water is pretty good at the min,ammonia,nitrite both zero
nitrate 20mgl
kh 5
gh12
ph 7.4
tds in the pond 280(220 from the purifier)
the koi look great.
as you know i run showers straight from the b/drains as my main filtration,on the skimmer i have two Dave a 24" vortex's first static k, 2nd jap matt,i flush the static k to waste every day.the water fills on a trickle to waste system currently i change around 100galls per day.
i was mainly thinking of running a r/o system to reduce the gh(although i know this cannot be done without lowering the kh) and reduce the tds to around the 100>150 mark.
do you think i can obtain these figures without changing massive amounts of water?
what is the biggest change you have seen in your koi?
thanks again.
Dave.
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Gazza
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Hi Dave,
Yes you can get down to 150-100 no problem and with a lower TDS to start with means you will use less water to get there.Once where you want to go you can just trickle it in as and when to keep it at your desired level.I believe Dave A got his TDS down quicker than he thought and look at the size of his pond.
My koi seem to of changed as they are more lively and seem to want to eat all the time and look great they all feel great i know this as they told me
Yes you can get down to 150-100 no problem and with a lower TDS to start with means you will use less water to get there.Once where you want to go you can just trickle it in as and when to keep it at your desired level.I believe Dave A got his TDS down quicker than he thought and look at the size of his pond.
My koi seem to of changed as they are more lively and seem to want to eat all the time and look great they all feel great i know this as they told me
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Gazza
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Hi Dave,
Yes Dave has invested in one and i think he like it
I bet they will love the idea and as you say you are trickling water in anyway,i seem to use a lot of water and i am on a meter so i thought why not give this a try and see what happens as long as the water does not go to mad then i will stick with it especially with what i have seen so far.
It will be interesting to see what the koi are like in the coming year and when the summer gets here
Yes Dave has invested in one and i think he like it
I bet they will love the idea and as you say you are trickling water in anyway,i seem to use a lot of water and i am on a meter so i thought why not give this a try and see what happens as long as the water does not go to mad then i will stick with it especially with what i have seen so far.
It will be interesting to see what the koi are like in the coming year and when the summer gets here
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vippymini
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well it seems as more and more people are going down the RO route to improve on their water quality.
so heres my little idea:-
As most koi keepers use a water purifier (normally a 3off 10" pod type) to feed the pond, could all these koi-keepers not just purchase the RO pod and membrane (or even two or three) and add them onto the end of the current water filter... therefore saving them money.....?
so heres my little idea:-
As most koi keepers use a water purifier (normally a 3off 10" pod type) to feed the pond, could all these koi-keepers not just purchase the RO pod and membrane (or even two or three) and add them onto the end of the current water filter... therefore saving them money.....?
Gazza, I have found it totally unnecessary to purify the small amount of fresh water required for an RO/fresh water mix. The volume of fresh untreated water is so low if straight from mains that any unwanted elements are totally insignificant. I did originally rig a bypass to tap off pretreated water to add to the RO water, only to find it totally uneccessary. In fact it required fairly large amounts to achieve a result, which for those on water meters is very relavent. It takes much less tap water to do the job, due to the higher mineral content. Any Chlorine in the mix at these volumes is I assure you ( I have tested both chemically and with a Chlorine meter) unmeasurable, and anyway would take minutes at most to dissipate in a recirculating pond.
Just thought i'd share that as I did all the research/testing for this weeks ago, so may save some time for someone.
Chi
Just thought i'd share that as I did all the research/testing for this weeks ago, so may save some time for someone.
Chi