Building Ponds & Filtration Questions ?????

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Gazza
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Building Ponds & Filtration Questions ?????

Post by Gazza »

Hi Guys,

I have been asked a few questions recently about ponds and filtration and knowing there are a few people looking at building ponds this year i thought we could have a bit of a chat on what you think is good or bad in pond builds or filtration and building.

So come on guys lets have some banter about what you did or what you would like to do or what you think you would like to do and if you have some it will be great to add some pictures :D
steven perkins
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Re: Building Ponds & Filtration Questions ?????

Post by steven perkins »

what a great topic :)

i am currently building a 121 square meter heated, breeding and growing house :) something i have dreamed of doing for a long time ,,

this will house several pools and if i can upload the pictures of the build i will :)

everything i have learned throughout the years will be use to develope the best conditions for these koi

i will give step by step instuctions of the whole set up for all those building a new koi pool

perky
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Re: Building Ponds & Filtration Questions ?????

Post by eds »

My build is currently ongoing (though paused with the bad weather) but will be flat bottomed with an aerated bottom drain and skimmer gravity feeding into the mechanical filtration then pumped over a shower which will return sub-surface back into the pond. Very low maintenance hopefully and perfect fish growing conditions. I'm going to turn the volume over about once an hour and with the aerated drain and smooth base that I've seen on many ponds, plus the fish moving waste around, I don't think benching is needed. And, as I'm going with a box-welded liner, it makes it a much easier build!
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Re: Building Ponds & Filtration Questions ?????

Post by steven perkins »

can you upload pictures ???
my files seem to big :(

perky
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Re: Building Ponds & Filtration Questions ?????

Post by eds »

steven perkins wrote:can you upload pictures ???
my files seem to big :(

perky
I find it best to use photobucket to upload them and then embed the links to show the pictures.

Like this,
Image
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Re: Building Ponds & Filtration Questions ?????

Post by steven perkins »

i am glad i dont rely on my koi moving there own crap around :)
my water system dose this for them , it works like a whirl pool ,,and it makes them much happier :)

you can pump as much water as you like ,, but if it dose not circulate around the whole pool your waisting half your efforts
and also filtration space ,,

perky
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Re: Building Ponds & Filtration Questions ?????

Post by steven perkins »

oh ,, photo bucket ,,,
i was trying to upload them off my lap top,,,

fail !!!!

lol

perky

show us your pool lol not your tree :)
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Re: Building Ponds & Filtration Questions ?????

Post by Gazza »

Blimey i thought i may of seen some pond pictures by now come on guys :D :lol:

Steve its best to load the pictures onto photobucket and then all you do is open the picture you want to load then go to properties - highlight the link - then right click and copy the link - then come back to your page that you are posting on and paste it in the position and once you have done this just click on the button (9th one along) marked IMG just above where you are typing and they should do the job.

Many of us do have fairly big turnovers on our ponds so there is plenty of current in our ponds to help all the waste through and we have to remember for newbies looking in we need to explain this correctly so they do not get the wrong end of the stick and try to turn their ponds over to fast or get confused :? :?

OK so we would like to have a good turnover on our pond which means the amount of time it takes us to pass entire the water through our filter system or systems per hour. So is we have a 2,000 gallon system this will mean we would be looking at turning over 2,000 gallons per hour to do so and with this we have to take into account that its not just a simle case of installing a 2,000 gph pump as we have to look at pipe runs and the head of water (the head of water is the amount the pump will need to pump up if necessary).

One of the many things that are overlooked during pond builds and filter construction/installation is getting the correct flow through the filter to allow the water to have enough contact time with the chosen media within the filters. It does not matter what media you are using they will all have an area that bacteria will "stick" to but its the efficiency of the media that countws and this will contribute to the contact time needed with the passing water. Out of interest the bacteria that work to help reduce the Ammonia will work quicker that the bacteria that work to reduce the Nitrite. So as you can see its not just build the pond stick a filter on and pump it fast as all that will happen is you will end up with water clarity and quality issues and for sure the fish wont like it :roll:

There are two types of filtration to a filter and these both need to work hand in hand and efficiently to do the job required to give our fish the best environment we can and if either one of these is not functioning for any reason be it flow to fast or slow then our water quality will be poor which in turn can lead to health issues in the pond. As we know the fish are swimming in the water 24/7 and are basically swimming around in a closed system which can be full of pollutants if the filters are not functioning correctly or even the system is not looked after by the owner. So this is the bit where we come in with our filtration and looking after the filters keeping them clean and changing water and making sure we keep the pollutants to a minimum at all times to keep our fish happy,after all the fish are basically swimming round in their own toilet and if this doesn't get cleaned or has an incwrfient filter.........wel could you imagine being in a room with no windows or doors or fresh are and having a toilet in the corner :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

So what are the two types of filtration in our filters and how do they work :

1. Mechanical Filtration.

This to me is one of the most important parts of filtration as this can cause or be the cause of the start of all sorts of problems from nasty little critters that love a bit of waste and also can hamper the biological bacteria trying to do its good work on the media.

This is the first port of call for the water coming from the pond carrying the water into the first stage of you filtration system weather it be a vortex,brushes,bucket,
settlement chamber anything where the water enters the filter system this is where we need to be removing the waste (not fines). This is the bulk type waste which is coming from the pond as in the waste like fish poo or debris anything that is in the pond to be removed as we do not want any build up within the pond of waste or debris which could cause problems if it was to be left to build up. The mechanical stage is also there so any waste that does get pulled from the pond does not pass through to the biological stage where the "good bacteria" is trying to work away and remove the pollutants which are in the water that we can not see.

The removal of all the waste from the pond and before the biological stage of our filters is very important and a must if you want to have happy healthy fish :D

2. Biological Filtration

This is where all the "good bacteria" do their stuff working away day and night 24/7 365 days a year to make sure the water we pass through the filter media has a good colony of bacteria to do their thing so when we pump it back to the pond the fish are not getting any pollutants that we with the human eye can not see pumped back into the pond. The good bacteria are clever little guys and they have all been doing this for millions of years so we don't need to worry to much as if we give them a good enough environment they will love it and thrive its only when the environment is not so good will they not be able to function correctly and then we can have problems :shock:

I am sure we all know the Nitrogen Cycle this is where the bacteria convert all the water pollutants to the "good stuff" our fish require and this is the cycle that needs to happen in our biological filters all the time to convert the bad water to good within the system as the fish do not like the ammonia and nitrite that can be produced in the system. The first conversion is the ammonia and this is done by nitrosomonas bacteria who convert the ammonia polluted water into nitrite so we have gone from one nasty to another but within the nitrogen cycle there is another bacteria which then converts the nitrite into nitrate and that is nitrate as this is good for the fish and us as nitrate is not as toxic as the ammonia or nitrite happy days :D

Both of the above parts of the filtration need to be set up and looked after to make sure we keep them running spot on and in doing so keeping the water our fish need nice and free from pollutants. So when we set them up we have to make sure we are pulling all the waste from the pond and it is getting removed in the mechanical stages of the filter before passing to the biological stages of the filters and being converted to "good water"

Set up is the key and its not always easy to get it right first time and it can take time and tinkering to get things set up correctly but when you do and the system works and is removing all the waste and giving the quality of water the fish need you will find the fish will be happy in their environment and this can lead to less health issues in the future if maintained.

Well thats enough from me and this is only a very small amount on the subject we have all sorts of aspects on pond building and filtration so chip in and i will have a look for some pictures to post later on :D
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Re: Building Ponds & Filtration Questions ?????

Post by eds »

steven perkins wrote:i am glad i dont rely on my koi moving there own crap around :)
my water system dose this for them , it works like a whirl pool ,,and it makes them much happier :)

you can pump as much water as you like ,, but if it dose not circulate around the whole pool your waisting half your efforts
and also filtration space ,,

perky
But you do rely on them; currents alone won't move heavy wastes on even a heavily benched bottom. Even in my vortex chamber, which is benched more than any pond I have seen, with the inlet creating a sweeping circular current, waste still rests on the bottom away from the centre drain. Until I drain the chamber and swirl the waste around it sits there!

The issue is that unless your pond bottom is absolutely perfectly smooth, with no algae at all, and all the waste in your pond rolls nicely down the slope towards the bottom drain all benching does is help waste move down towards the drain - it doesn't make it move. Adding an aerated drain can make a much bigger difference than benching - so much of a difference in fact that you can dispense with the benching.

So benching and good currents help but other factors may be more important.
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Re: Building Ponds & Filtration Questions ?????

Post by steven perkins »

hi

i stand by what i say ,,,

and i think ed did too , in a way ,,

at the end of the day we all want whats best for our koi ,

cheers

perky
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Re: Building Ponds & Filtration Questions ?????

Post by Gazza »

Hi Guys,

Looks like i need to get the pond building pictures going with my build and here are some pictures from my pond build:

The new pond was to replace the old one behind the vat as we had some cracked blocks and the pond did not work as i wanted so it was time for a bit of a dig and a new build to see if i could get it correct on the second attempt.So a vat was set up to keep the old munters in while a new pond was built and the idea was to get it done as fast as we could as we started toward the end of August and i wanted to get it done before the winter got hold so the idea was to have the fish in before it started to get to cold. As normal it was a bit of a battle because as soon as i started we had heavy rain and at one point we had two ponds :shock: only they was mud ponds :lol:

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Digging was very hard as most of it was clay and flint and this was all done by hand and barrowed to the front of the house where we had the skips for the removal of the spoil. We had previously had a nice pergola in the are of the new pond and i did promise the wife i would put a new one back....just a bit bigger with a pond under it :wink:

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Once all dug out and cleaned up it was time for the base to be laid which was done with re-inforced mesh and a ready-mix lorry and then it was all barrowed in and into the pond.There was some concrete blocks set into this that are also re-inforced and it was left to go off ready for the walls to start going up :D

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Then it was full steam ahead and we laid our blocks on the side for maximum strength (yes i know we build them tooooo strong :D ) all the way up on both the side wall and the back wall as these would not need any face brick and would not be seen. The front curved wall has face brick so the blocks where laid as normal so the face brick could be added and tied in and also this was back filled.

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Once the building was all done it was time to clean up all the render and make sure it was all clean and free from dust so it could be fiberglassed :D I was starting to think it would have fish in at any time now and was looking forward to getting the filters sorted very soon :D

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So there is a quick view of my little build and how my pond was built from the removal of the old pond and setting up the vat to house the koi and the digging of the pond and all the building works it was hard work but well worth it and we was glad with the pond once finished.So all that was left to do was to make the filtration and fit it behind the shed,install all the pipe work and pumps,install the new waste system and pump so i can pump the waste away when cleaning,Install all the electrics into the shed for the pumps and equipment,install the new water pipes so there is water available in the filter are so i don't need to mess about with hose pipes,install the gas to the shed and install the new boiler for the heating............i am sure i have forgotten something if so we will pick it up later :D :wink:

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Re: Building Ponds & Filtration Questions ?????

Post by steven perkins »

Gazza

what a great build :) and great pics too :)

i dont have photo bucket but i will get it :)

i have a great koi pool :) and am currently building my own breeding house at the back of my workshop ,, i am really exited and getting it all done before may is on track :)

cheers

perky
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Re: Building Ponds & Filtration Questions ?????

Post by martyn james »

Gazza

I like the look of your pond, good pictures .
how many gallons?
if any body else has some pond build pictures that would be great

Martyn :D
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Re: Building Ponds & Filtration Questions ?????

Post by Gazza »

Hi Martyn,

My pond is 4500 gls (well a tad just under to be exact ) :D

I was hoping there will be a few other ponds on here to keep it going and to help newbies lets hope Perky has got a photobucket account sorted and posts some pictures of his set up.
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Re: Building Ponds & Filtration Questions ?????

Post by eds »

Can post a few of my pond but don't have any of the construction.

An old close up view of the pond.
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The filter area, before it was converted to K1.
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Now covered with decking,
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From the filter the water is pumped up the garden to a trickle filter at the top which feeds into a top pond with a gunnera in and over the waterfall,
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The waterfall drops into a cobble lined plunge pool,
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And then flows down a shallow stream section planted with watercress, Acorus and arrowheads.
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The stream then deepens to 2ft and flows all down the side of the garden back into the pool,
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The fish can swim all the way up the deep section of the stream so about 20m sprint if they want!

The pond was built with concrete base, blockwork walls and engineering brick front then rendered with fibre reinforced mix and painted with G4. Filtration is a large concrete vortex chamber feeding into static K1 then fluidised K1 before being pumped up to the trickle filter.
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