I’ve taken the plunge into RO, early days yet but data from those running RO units would be very helpful.
What KH test kits do you use?
1) What are your readings
KH GH PH TDS
Purifier :
RO unit :
Mixed :
Pond :
2) How much water do you change or flow through each week?
3) Do you use any buffering for KH ?
Regards
Dave
To those running RO Units
Moderators: B.Scott, vippymini, Gazza, Manky Sanke
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Gazza
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Hi Dave,
Well my readings are a bit higher than normal due to a bit of over top up with mains water when i was away
My supply water is very hard PH 8.5 and above with a TDS of around 660 when i last tested
I like to run the pond at a PH of around 7ish and a TDS around 150-200 but could go lower but as i am relatively new at this i decided to take it easy.
I run electronic meters so i can see the PH & TDS all the time 24/7 (apart from one of those also going up the wall whilst on holiday ) so i can see what the pond is doing and that the PH and TDS are stable.I do test the KH & Gh using a NT labs test kit and try to keep the KH lowish around 2-3.
Why would you want to buffer you KH if you keep your eye on the water and do regular water changes and top ups mixing the water you should be OK as the KH shouldn't get used up.
The main thing to remember is when you start messing with the water YOU MUST keep you eye on the ball at all times to make sure all is running spot on.
Do i think it makes a difference well i would defiantly say yes i can see and have seen a defiance in the fish in terms of health,skin quality,behavior and growth
Well my readings are a bit higher than normal due to a bit of over top up with mains water when i was away
My supply water is very hard PH 8.5 and above with a TDS of around 660 when i last tested
I like to run the pond at a PH of around 7ish and a TDS around 150-200 but could go lower but as i am relatively new at this i decided to take it easy.
I run electronic meters so i can see the PH & TDS all the time 24/7 (apart from one of those also going up the wall whilst on holiday
) so i can see what the pond is doing and that the PH and TDS are stable.I do test the KH & Gh using a NT labs test kit and try to keep the KH lowish around 2-3.Why would you want to buffer you KH if you keep your eye on the water and do regular water changes and top ups mixing the water you should be OK as the KH shouldn't get used up.
The main thing to remember is when you start messing with the water YOU MUST keep you eye on the ball at all times to make sure all is running spot on.
Do i think it makes a difference well i would defiantly say yes i can see and have seen a defiance in the fish in terms of health,skin quality,behavior and growth
Very helpful Gazza.
I am looking at Purifer TDS 540, GH18, KH6 to 7
2 RO to 1 purifier mix gives me KH 3, GH 8, TDS 210.
3 RO to 1 gives KH2, GH6, TDS 160.
Totally agree about keeping a very close eye on things; I have Hanna and Pinpoint meters etc;
Think I will be looking at 2 to 1 for the time being.
The KH buffer came from seeing a thread in which Duncan mentions having oyster shells in his system.
RU running RO in your Growing On system as well as your main pond?
Regards
Dave
I am looking at Purifer TDS 540, GH18, KH6 to 7
2 RO to 1 purifier mix gives me KH 3, GH 8, TDS 210.
3 RO to 1 gives KH2, GH6, TDS 160.
Totally agree about keeping a very close eye on things; I have Hanna and Pinpoint meters etc;
Think I will be looking at 2 to 1 for the time being.
The KH buffer came from seeing a thread in which Duncan mentions having oyster shells in his system.
RU running RO in your Growing On system as well as your main pond?
Regards
Dave
I'm really interested in why people think RO water makes such a difference for koi (I'm not, for a second doubting the results, just wondering why).
I use RO on all my tropical tanks and it makes a huge difference to fish health/colours IMO, but they are all soft water fish.
AFAIK koi don't seem to prefer soft water so do you think that they prefer the lower TDS, or is it that the RO unit removes other things, such as Nitrates and Phosphates, metals etc?
Just being curious!
I use RO on all my tropical tanks and it makes a huge difference to fish health/colours IMO, but they are all soft water fish.
AFAIK koi don't seem to prefer soft water so do you think that they prefer the lower TDS, or is it that the RO unit removes other things, such as Nitrates and Phosphates, metals etc?
Just being curious!
Good point!
All the data, scientific and aquacultural, I've seen for common carp says they prefer a neutral to slightly basic water of 7.0 - 7.5, but are very adaptable to other conditions. I'm of course not saying accepted wisdom is always true, but AFAIK, most rivers in temperate areas seem to be more basic due to the reduced decomposition of organic matter, I assume.
If I'm wrong please tell me where you got the info from!!!
All the data, scientific and aquacultural, I've seen for common carp says they prefer a neutral to slightly basic water of 7.0 - 7.5, but are very adaptable to other conditions. I'm of course not saying accepted wisdom is always true, but AFAIK, most rivers in temperate areas seem to be more basic due to the reduced decomposition of organic matter, I assume.
If I'm wrong please tell me where you got the info from!!!
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Gazza
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Hi Ed,
You may want to search out board as there are some good threads about RO and stuff.
Our koi do like it around 7 - 7.5 and i would die for water like that instead of the tar i have
I have also attached a couple of links which may also hopefully give you some info on soft water and RO.
http://www.yumekoi.com/articles/aug_2003.pdf
http://www.yumekoi.com/articles/sept_2003.pdf
You may want to search out board as there are some good threads about RO and stuff.
Our koi do like it around 7 - 7.5 and i would die for water like that instead of the tar i have
I have also attached a couple of links which may also hopefully give you some info on soft water and RO.
http://www.yumekoi.com/articles/aug_2003.pdf
http://www.yumekoi.com/articles/sept_2003.pdf
Hi Ed,
Think that as with anything else, in fishkeeping or life there are always conflicting views, in the end you keep an open mind, do your research and then make your decisions.
My supply water is pretty rank, GH 18 PH 8.4 TDS 540, High Nitrates and , Phosphate.
PH is one part of the equation.
I was influenced by the articles Gazza refers to as well as Duncan’s book and Maurice Cox.
It’s certainly doesn’t come cheap and adds more work to the daily schedule, but at the end of the day I am relaxed with that, if it gives our pets a better enviroment then it will be worth it.
It is early days but in a year I will probably be able to give some more educated feedback on the benefits.
Regards
Dave
Think that as with anything else, in fishkeeping or life there are always conflicting views, in the end you keep an open mind, do your research and then make your decisions.
My supply water is pretty rank, GH 18 PH 8.4 TDS 540, High Nitrates and , Phosphate.
PH is one part of the equation.
I was influenced by the articles Gazza refers to as well as Duncan’s book and Maurice Cox.
It’s certainly doesn’t come cheap and adds more work to the daily schedule, but at the end of the day I am relaxed with that, if it gives our pets a better enviroment then it will be worth it.
It is early days but in a year I will probably be able to give some more educated feedback on the benefits.
Regards
Dave
Hi
First of all, I request excuses by my bad English. this is my first intervention in the forum and I´d like to take this opportunity to send my congratulation
In many occasions, much of an equipment RO is expected, but its operation is enough unknown,
A Ro equipment must reduce in a minimum of 95% the TDS of entrance, if it is not thus, its operation is incorrect. The small equipment of osmosis spends very many water and reduces in smaller amount the TDS of the water
Another problem is the concept of where to use the water., In the filled up one? or renovation of the pond?
In the filled up one it is important to verify as of the parameters they are reduced by equipment RO. all the chemical compounds are not reduced in the same amount, and as it were indicated this way, pH is single one of the elements that are reduced.
The NH3 is retained in smaller amount than calcium. The CO2 is permeable and happens in its totality through the membrane, pH usually lowers due to it.
I think that it is very important to value as it is the water contribution of that we arrange consequently and, to choose a type of treatment or another one. The water of Spain is not the same one mostly that the one of UK, just as the water of London to be adiferente that the one of Manchester, for example.
Each treatment must go accompanied of a study of the water of our zone, and we do not have to consider that the option of some authors is correct for all the sites, nor to all the situations
Pardon by the extension of this first message
Regards.
Pere
First of all, I request excuses by my bad English. this is my first intervention in the forum and I´d like to take this opportunity to send my congratulation
In many occasions, much of an equipment RO is expected, but its operation is enough unknown,
A Ro equipment must reduce in a minimum of 95% the TDS of entrance, if it is not thus, its operation is incorrect. The small equipment of osmosis spends very many water and reduces in smaller amount the TDS of the water
Another problem is the concept of where to use the water., In the filled up one? or renovation of the pond?
In the filled up one it is important to verify as of the parameters they are reduced by equipment RO. all the chemical compounds are not reduced in the same amount, and as it were indicated this way, pH is single one of the elements that are reduced.
The NH3 is retained in smaller amount than calcium. The CO2 is permeable and happens in its totality through the membrane, pH usually lowers due to it.
I think that it is very important to value as it is the water contribution of that we arrange consequently and, to choose a type of treatment or another one. The water of Spain is not the same one mostly that the one of UK, just as the water of London to be adiferente that the one of Manchester, for example.
Each treatment must go accompanied of a study of the water of our zone, and we do not have to consider that the option of some authors is correct for all the sites, nor to all the situations
Pardon by the extension of this first message
Regards.
Pere
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Gazza
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- Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2005 7:24 pm
- Location: Essex,UK
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Hi Dave,
You are spot on Dave like everything in life there always pros and cons and those that do and those that don't.We struggle in our own way to do the best we can and as we all know there is more than one road to koi
So how long have you been running the RO and what are your readings now and have you seen any changes yet
Hi Ed,
Hope the info was of help as that guys know a little about fish and water
Hi Pere,
Welcome to Koi Quest and don't worry about your English is far far better than my Spanish
You are spot on Dave like everything in life there always pros and cons and those that do and those that don't.We struggle in our own way to do the best we can and as we all know there is more than one road to koi
So how long have you been running the RO and what are your readings now and have you seen any changes yet
Hi Ed,
Hope the info was of help as that guys know a little about fish and water
Hi Pere,
Welcome to Koi Quest and don't worry about your English is far far better than my Spanish
Always good to get info on anything! Strange as with killis, soft water is generally poorer for growth than harder water, but then that hard water isn't really hard, if you know what I mean! They get bigger in harder water.Gazza wrote:Hi Ed,
Hope the info was of help as that guys know a little about fish and water
My tap water TDS is 135, so not astronomical IMO. Haven't had chance to check the pond yet, rather busy at school!
I'll have to have a chat with Mike as I'm sure he'll be at Maurice's in a few weeks! Don't know as even he will be able to persuade me though!!!
If anyone would like to know a lot about R/O ,
Try contacting Craig at Kingdom Koi , www.kingdomkoi.co.uk
He runs courses upto NVQ level teaching about it, his company has recently fitted a 25,000 litre per day R/O into a local zoo. He also has some massive r/o and softener plants at his main Koi shop.
Try contacting Craig at Kingdom Koi , www.kingdomkoi.co.uk
He runs courses upto NVQ level teaching about it, his company has recently fitted a 25,000 litre per day R/O into a local zoo. He also has some massive r/o and softener plants at his main Koi shop.
Eds - Tap water TDS of 135 
That would be dreamland for us Essex boys blessed with GH18 KH6. (TDS 427 before the rest of the ****!)
Gazza -
Running Three weeks.
Purifier TDS 540
Main pond 5800 gallons
@ start Now
TDS 450 300
PH 8.4 7.9
GH 18 9
KH 6 3
TEMP 20 20
ORP 260 260
ORP has been depressed following Cloverleaf treatment which normally knocks it down by 60 to 70 points for several weeks. Currenly running at 260 which is 20 down on normal. Feed rates pretty heavy.
PH swing between morning and evening is 0.1.
Nitrate has reduced from 20 to 5 which should help slow the BW!
System performance is good considering I am not running a pump, getting 1.8 - 2L min at 32psi!
Output TDS between 20 and 30.
Mixing at 2RO :1Purifer which gives me a TDS of 210, KH3, GH7, PH7.5
The relatively low KH in the supply to high tap TDS is going to limit my eventual Pond TDS, (hence my question about buffering 
) current goal is get it nice and stable at around 250 and to keep the KH at 3, guess the PH will end up 7.4 to 7.6 ish. Until I gain some confidence and experience I am going to take it easy on the KH front!
At present it's monitoring and then more monitoring!
Regards
Dave
That would be dreamland for us Essex boys blessed with GH18 KH6. (TDS 427 before the rest of the ****!) Gazza -
Running Three weeks.
Purifier TDS 540
Main pond 5800 gallons
@ start Now
TDS 450 300
PH 8.4 7.9
GH 18 9
KH 6 3
TEMP 20 20
ORP 260 260
ORP has been depressed following Cloverleaf treatment which normally knocks it down by 60 to 70 points for several weeks. Currenly running at 260 which is 20 down on normal. Feed rates pretty heavy.
PH swing between morning and evening is 0.1.
Nitrate has reduced from 20 to 5 which should help slow the BW!
System performance is good considering I am not running a pump, getting 1.8 - 2L min at 32psi!
Output TDS between 20 and 30.
Mixing at 2RO :1Purifer which gives me a TDS of 210, KH3, GH7, PH7.5
The relatively low KH in the supply to high tap TDS is going to limit my eventual Pond TDS, (hence my question about buffering
) current goal is get it nice and stable at around 250 and to keep the KH at 3, guess the PH will end up 7.4 to 7.6 ish. Until I gain some confidence and experience I am going to take it easy on the KH front!At present it's monitoring and then more monitoring!
Regards
Dave