Alphagrog or K1?

[rallying1]

I am thinking of changing my filtration arround to try and improve my water quality, i have a 4 bay and vortex.
My idea is to go with brushes in the vortex, bay 1 jap mat, bay 2 jap mat, bay 3 K1 without air, and bay 4 either as the tittle says, K1 with air or Alphagrog/
whats best or am I completely heading the wrong way?

At the moment its vortex, bay1 brushes, bay 2 japmat, bay 3 K1 with air, bay 4 jap mat with air.

thank you folks!!

[fishy hands]

i have alfagrog in my end bays . when i asked around wether to keep it or change it i was advised go for k1

[Gazza]

There are a few ways to go and it will depend on what multi bay you have and way you would like to do.

If it was i you could look at (depending on size) using the vortex as a settlement and if possible static K1 and then have some aerated K1 and the last chambers you could use the matting. If you do upgrade the system please remember not to do it all the same time as that could put a strain on the filters and i personally would try to get the mechanical side sorted first.

[Duncan]

hi

i dont understand the logic here of what you propose its seems to be at odds with how bio systems work, heres why

a vortex with brushes in ceases to be a vortex and will not work as one and how it is supposed to work ( see my articles above on the vortex and then if you like Japanese matting by that one)

the two japanese matting carts are ok no problem with this, but then you propose a staic K1 in chamber 3 which is a mechanical sediment trap. why a crap trap in the middle? this should be at the start to clean the water before enetering the bio stages then a fluidised K1 chamber again ok with this

heres what you should do put your static K1 idea in the vortex in the form of an "eazy" this will give you good water cleaning ( in my hubble opinion the EAZY is the best invention for effeciency verses foot print and ease of cleaning) put Japanese matting cartridges in bays 1,2 and 3 and fluidised K1 at the end job done and sorted
if you want to use alphagrog use this in the last bay in place of the fluidised K1

dunc

[rallying1]

Hi Dunc

the reason I am asking these questions is because when I picked up the vortex and filters (second hand kockney) the media was just thrown in a bag and I had to try and work out what went where as best i could. I understand what you say about the vortex and thats whay i asked the question about going in the wrong direction, someone suggested it was a good idea??? sounds like it isnt !
I am very new to all this so mechanical sediment trap? no idea what that is, whats an easy? footprint? I am lost already, bay 1 has the brushes in so if I follow your route do I disregard those and go jap mat 1,2,3 and K1 at the end? Oh dear I am hopeless at all this.

My problem is I am still getting some solids in my final bay which I would have thought should be long gone before then, and my water is still a bit murky, I have upped my turn over time and it has improved quite a lot though, thats why I thought my set up was wrong?

Dunc your Help is very much appreciated!

[StuW]

Hi Dunc

the reason I am asking these questions is because when I picked up the vortex and filters (second hand kockney) the media was just thrown in a bag and I had to try and work out what went where as best i could. I understand what you say about the vortex and thats whay i asked the question about going in the wrong direction, someone suggested it was a good idea??? sounds like it isnt !
I am very new to all this so mechanical sediment trap?mechanical trather than biological filtration no idea what that is, whats an easy? footprint?area taken up by filter, the smaller the footprint the less space it takes up on the ground I am lost already, bay 1 has the brushes in so if I follow your route do I disregard those yes and go jap mat 1,2,3 and K1 at the end? Oh dear I am hopeless at all this.

My problem is I am still getting some solids in my final bay which I would have thought should be long gone before then,because you do not have enough efficient mechanical filtration and my water is still a bit murky, Static K1 in vortex or chamber 1 should resolve this I have upped my turn over time and it has improved quite a lot though, thats why I thought my set up was wrong?

Dunc your Help is very much appreciated!

Hope this helps

[Duncan]

hi

im in devon at the moment doing this from my iphone

will try and asnwer this when i get back whats the sizes of your chambers vortex diameter? etc

the heart of a great filter system is the filtering out of matter before it gets to you biological stages you need to get this done as efficiently possible before the bio stage

ITMT have a look on the main site for filter basics http://www.koiquest.co.uk/filters.htm

[rallying1]

A picture paimts 1000 words eh right this is my set up Dunc, the vortex is 800 deep and 650mm wide at top. 4 bay filter is as you can see brushes then jap mat then k1with air then jap mat again with air, bays are 800 deep 450 wide and 650 across, what do you think |i should be doing?

[Duncan]

hi

the picture helps a lot what is your flow rate and your stocking levels
the set up for this filter looks fine , but my gut reaction is would not alter this from the way it is the filtration is so marginal i doubt any kind of change is going to make the difference put simply its tooo small and i doubt you are going to see much if any improvment what ever you put in something this size without increasing the volume of these chanmbers

you could do with sorting the Japanese mattoing cartridges so they are better configured 35mm square voids and more of them rather than huge slotted voids see japanese matting explained above in the sticky section

other than that you look to be running at 100% for a filter this size do not remove the brushes at the diameter of this vortex i doubt it will work every well as a voretex so thats why the brushes were placed in there in the first place

so in short apart from doing the Japanese matting cartridges spaceings correctly ( and that will improve things) i doubt you will improve on what you have

although limited size its one of the better ones i have seen set up in a long time so unless you wanna spend loads more dosh my advice if it aint broke dont try and fix it

[rallying1]

Dunc, your a star thank you, the flow rates Im afraid I dont know, I have a 4inch drain to the filters then a grundfos heating pump on number 3 putting it back in the pond, thats about as much as I can tell you, I have 14 Koi in a pond that is 7ft deep 10ft long and 5ft wide. most are 2yrs old I have 4 that are about 15inches ( you can see the Plat). This is the pond a while ago before I changed the filtration form what i had which was pants, to what i have now, to be fair it is HUGELY better, so all in all you think apart from spacing the jap mat (on it this week end) leave it alone?